Manny Pacquiao vs Julio Cesar Chavez at 135lb

[Southpaw16BF]

Who wins and how?

[CarlosG815]

Chavez by mutilation.

Chavez is fast and Manny takes a lot of punches from everybody he faces. Chavez has too much power for Manny to eat his punches and stick around.

Manny just isn't good enough to go toe to toe with certain ATG's and Chavez is a guy that just destroys him.

[STREET CLEANER]

Chavez at that weight was almost unbeatable. Chavez would had broken him down as he did to countles of others

[Wukillabeez78]

Contrary to what another poster said Chavez was not fast (he didn't have good footspeed and didn't possess fast hands). He was a great tactician though and was still adept at cutting off the ring when facing faster fighters (pretty much all of the elite fighters he fought were faster than him).

This fight would be pretty entertaining. Manny has a definite edge as far as foot and handspeed. I'd say their power would be even. Chavez has a better chin than Manny. As far as intangibles and ring intelligence I'd say Chavez has a big edge. Manny will do things like take the other guys best shot just to see what he has (like he did against Cotto). If he did this against Chavez he'd be in serious trouble. Chavez was just a better thinker in the ring than Manny though. Manny is always going to bring the fight to you and try to knock you out. Chavez was a great counter puncher so Manny's style is tailor made for him. I don't think Manny could KO Chavez even if he hit him with good shots and I think Chavez would eventually wear Manny down and finish him.

[JourneymanUK]

Another fantasy match. I'd say Chavez wins every round. Manny cannot win any fantasy match. That's proven. Next post.

[CarlosG815]

Another fantasy match. I'd say Chavez wins every round. Manny cannot win any fantasy match. That's proven. Next post.

Because he really isn't that great.

You say that with disdain and I'm curious as to why.

[CarlosG815]

Contrary to what another poster said Chavez was not fast (he didn't have good footspeed and didn't possess fast hands). He was a great tactician though and was still adept at cutting off the ring when facing faster fighters (pretty much all of the elite fighters he fought were faster than him).

This fight would be pretty entertaining. Manny has a definite edge as far as foot and handspeed. I'd say their power would be even. Chavez has a better chin than Manny. As far as intangibles and ring intelligence I'd say Chavez has a big edge. Manny will do things like take the other guys best shot just to see what he has (like he did against Cotto). If he did this against Chavez he'd be in serious trouble. Chavez was just a better thinker in the ring than Manny though. Manny is always going to bring the fight to you and try to knock you out. Chavez was a great counter puncher so Manny's style is tailor made for him. I don't think Manny could KO Chavez even if he hit him with good shots and I think Chavez would eventually wear Manny down and finish him.

Meldrick Taylor was incredibly fast and Chavez, while not as fast, was able to keep up with him just fine.

Because Manny hops up and down that gives him an edge in footwork? I'm trying to understand what you mean because I've never seen Manny as a fighter with footwork.

And at 135 I don't think Manny matches Chavez in power.

Don't forget, Manny got beat by Morales and schooled by JMM who neither were as good as Chavez.

And tbh since those guys he hasn't fought anybody. And no over rated Cotto and Hatton don't count as top contenders IMO. We won't know what Manny is capable of until he fights some real contenders, which we all know Arum isn't ready to do at this point - Manny is too valuable to him. As long as 800k people are willing to buy a ppv and attend a live arena to see him beat up bums like Joshua Clottey, he'll keep doing that. Once Manny is shot and he has other big stars, he'll throw Manny into a big fight and once he's KO'd he'll step over Manny's KO'd body to the winner, recruit him, and Manny will be old news and probably not fight anymore. He's a guy that once he loses a couple big fights, his draw power is gone.

[baya]

chavez gets beaten badly at any weight by pac.

[Wukillabeez78]

Meldrick Taylor was incredibly fast and Chavez, while not as fast, was able to keep up with him just fine.

Because Manny hops up and down that gives him an edge in footwork? I'm trying to understand what you mean because I've never seen Manny as a fighter with footwork.

And at 135 I don't think Manny matches Chavez in power.

Don't forget, Manny got beat by Morales and schooled by JMM who neither were as good as Chavez.

And tbh since those guys he hasn't fought anybody. And no over rated Cotto and Hatton don't count as top contenders IMO. We won't know what Manny is capable of until he fights some real contenders, which we all know Arum isn't ready to do at this point - Manny is too valuable to him. As long as 800k people are willing to buy a ppv and attend a live arena to see him beat up bums like Joshua Clottey, he'll keep doing that. Once Manny is shot and he has other big stars, he'll throw Manny into a big fight and once he's KO'd he'll step over Manny's KO'd body to the winner, recruit him, and Manny will be old news and probably not fight anymore. He's a guy that once he loses a couple big fights, his draw power is gone.

Meldrick was incredibly fast and could have been a masterful boxer had he chosen to be but he was from Philly and was a fighter at his core. He was kind of like Shane Mosley in that regard. Both have the ability to box but have a lot of pride and will try to **** if you hit them. Meldrick had too much heart in that fight vs Chavez and lost because of it. He could have won a decision with his superior boxing ability but was still firing back at Chavez right before he got stopped.

Don't know what you're talking about in regards to Manny hopping up and down. He doesn't have great footwork compared to great movers like Pernell Whitaker or Floyd Mayweather but he is still very quick on his feet (much quicker than Chavez) and is very good at staying in punching range, getting in and getting back out after throwing his punches and coming in at angles to set up his punches that so many of his opponents don't see him throw.

I think Manny showed good power at 135 but I wouldn't argue with anybody who would rate Chavez's as being superior. Neither one really had consistent, one punch power. Both usually rely or had to rely on putting together more than one punch in a short sequence or over the course of a fight to achieve a KO.

Manny does still have a lot to prove, I agree. What he's done has been very exciting but I'd pick both Mayweather and Mosley to beat him if he fights either one in the future. I also feel Timothy Bradley and Devon Alexander would give Manny major problems and could defeat him.

[CarlosG815]

Don't know what you're talking about in regards to Manny hopping up and down.

Watch any of his fights. He's a well known hopper. Shawn Porter is a guy who you can tell tries to emulate Manny and one of the bad habits he's picked up is excessive hopping, and I think he gets that from sparring and training around Manny.



fast forward to around 1 minute when he gets on the mitts. He is a nonstop hopper. Watch film on Oscar, JMM, Barrera, etc. none of which were hoppers. I think this makes Manny somewhat predictable and when he fought Marquez he capitalized on it, catching Manny on the downward end of his hop and sent him off balance and had he followed up with a combo would have knocked him down.